City Council Work Session

Catherine Readgood evening I would like to call the special meeting and work session of September 30 September

Laszlo Palkostaffby voice3rd

Catherine Read2024 to order jumping ahead to the end of the month I am going to read a motion to conclude our closed meeting at 7 0 5 p.m. concluded its closed meeting to conduct interviews for boards and commissions and discuss appointments to boards and commissions I move that each of us certify that to the best of each council members knowledge one only public business matters lawfully exempted from the open meeting requirements in the free Virginia Freedom of Information Act and two only public business matters identified the motion commuting the closed meeting were heard discussed or considered all council members in favor of the certification motion please signify by voting aye aye those opposed to the motion please vote nay the

Catherine ReadThe motion passes for with one abstention. I will now recess the special meeting to go into work session. I will recognize Ms. Shinneberry for the first work session item for discussion. Our first item is a discussion and

Melissa Shinaberryclerkby voiceupdate on the Willow Sherwood Health and Community Center project. Brooke Hardin, Community Development and Planning Director, will provide the staff presentation. thank

Brooke Hardinstaffyou and pleased to be with you mayor and members of council this evening we were last here in February of this year for

Thomas Rossthe Willard Sherwood

Brooke Hardinstaffproject at that point the team was wrapping up schematic design things have progressed since then and the design development phase is now being wrapped up so we are here tonight seeking your authorization to move forward to construction documents with me this evening is James Patterson the city's project management consultant from Blue Heron leadership group and Stacy Summerfield the city's director of Parks and Recreation before you is the agenda for this evening we're going to touch on on the schedule and where we are with not not many changes necessarily since you last saw from a big picture but update you on the design as well as costs and budget for the project and then again get back to next steps at the end again seeking your authorization to

proceed to the next phase so with that I will turn it over to mr. Patterson to go through the slides

James Pattersonstaffthank you Brooke and good evening great to see you all I'll jump right in. The first element is just walking through the schedule. I didn't put a where we are now, but basically we're at the second. You guys can see my little highlighted pointer right here at the end of the third quarter of 2024 at this star. The stars represent when we get to the end of each design phase, it's a go-no-go. We share the cost updates, we share where the design is and we seek authorization to move to the next step of the design process which in this case would be the development of the construction documents phase so we're here this shows the construction document phase which is approximately nine months to go through that process this schedule assumes if approved tonight this is what the schedule would

look like the community and stakeholder engagement we've had two rounds we did it at concepts we did it at schematic and the architect I believe has done a great deal of incorporating and the feedback we've gotten as we've gone back to the community as they've really used that input to inform the design as they have gone forward so the community meetings have been very positive what we're showing on this next phase of community engagement is really more the stakeholders the parks and recreation advisory board to the commission of the arts to the community to the board of architectural review share where we are getting any additional feedback as we initiate this last phase of the design the permitting and entitlement here

it actually i could this blue line could go further back we had a pre-application meeting with the city we've met with the city's planning and development staff a number of times they provide a great direction to again to inform the site plan and the sup submission we made the application was submitted on july 15th so it's now in the review process which we anticipate to take about nine months to go all the way through the entitlement and come before the city council The site permitting actually can start right at the end of the entitlement process. So we have about nine months to go through the full thing, starting a little bit towards the end of calendar year 2024. And then the building permitting, once we're at about 95% construction documents, we go

through the building permitting process, which again takes about nine months. the key at the end of the construction document phase is we actually go into we've partnered with our CMAR the Christman company they're working with us they've actually been a fantastic partner they've provided they've what I call does it they've built the building on paper so they've really gone deep into the drawings which gives us a high confidence in the cost estimates we're getting now they're talking to a lot of the subs they will engage with down the road to get really good cost so it's really helpful having them on board early but when we finish a hundred percent they actually go through the process of officially buying out the contract so they go to the HVA sub a

structural sub the earthworks of steel working sub and they get actual prices is they use that to come up with a guaranteed maximum price that then they negotiate with us, with the city and the county. And that's the last star in the process. We will come back to the city council with what is that guaranteed maximum price that they're putting on the table to build it for. And then construction. There's a little bit of an error in this bar. The construction will start right at the end of calendar year 2025, the beginning of calendar year 2026 and then it will go to the end of calendar year 2028 and then we're actually in a warranty period for a year after that just I know we've gone through the design but I just want to kind of

refresh on a few things and feel free to interrupt me as I as I'm going through this. Basically, bird's-eye view, the site we're developing is about 2.4 acres that everything fits in there very tightly. It's a little over a hundred thousand square foot building. You're seeing in blue, those are the solar panels that will sit on top. This area right here is a rooftop amenity space associated with senior center and a little amenity space here that will be for the county's infant and toddler connection program. We are seeking to achieve LEED Gold certification for the building, so we have a lot of sustainability measures that are going. You can see here this is the connecting bridge on the second level, which connects the main level of the existing Sherwood

Community Center with the second floor of the new building. The site access to the building we're closing the old entrance that was here the eastern entrance off of Layton Hall the main entrances will be off Blenheim Blenheim Boulevard's doing a new left-hand turn lane that will come into the site here all this parking will remain as is we're building an interconnecting roadway here two-way that will come to the new site and then on the Layton Hall drive side I will be coming in right across from Democracy Boulevard straight across there you'll come into the site there's several surface parking spaces we're providing and then this is the ramp to the two-level underground garage where you go in down here the only other things to point out on this slide is

this little box right here is the optional improvements the performing arts then we're saving a 60-inch. One of the things that came up during the design is a 60-inch oak, willow oak, I believe, that we're saving here that we had to reconfigure a little bit to accomplish. This is looking from, if you're standing in the intersection of Blenheim and Layton Hall Drive, again you see the solar panels, you see the rooftop area, and the whole idea with this we're bocce ball but it's flexible space so however Stacy and her staff want to program it they can have bocce ball or they can put something else here there seating there's a little bit of an overhang to provide a little bit of shade that's on top the county daycare center is in this area this is a playground for

that daycare center this shows the transportation hub nicely that's being built with the Blenheim project. So the bus stop, there's going to be a bike share in this area right here. The two-way cycle track here and we're working closely with the transportation with Dave's team and the transportation group to make sure it's an integrated design. It doesn't feel like two different projects, you know, that it all goes well together. We moved one of the feedbacks we heard from the Board of Architecture Review and from the City Council was, if you remember, this ramp up to this other level, you used to have to go all the way down and around, and everybody said that was too far. So we actually reconfigured the ramp to come down

so it's more closely proximate to the transportation hub. And we're trying to, for the wayfinding signage, standards again so it has a really integrated look with the Blenheim improvements. This is another view you know coming in closer from that intersection and you get a really good view one of the things that City Council told us right off is they wanted something very iconic you know it's a very primary corner as you head north and Blenheim so something that really draws you in so the the rooftop feature here that's going to be made out of weddle metal but have a wood weddle so that's wood that looked it's a metal that looks like wood I invented a new word this is gonna be metal that looks like

wood a lot of glass here so the space in this area is a fitness classroom and then a fitness exercise area. So as you drive by you can kind of see what's happening inside the building. A lot of glass around this two-story entrance so really calls out that entrance. You have the glass for the gym and then these shade fans that go along here and they just put Fairfax on here for something but I think we heard from this group and we also heard from the Board of architectural review is it's a good opportunity to put some artwork and maybe something that shows you know fitness or wellness that represents what's happening inside the building. The site has always had a big topographic challenge. There's a 14-foot drop from the far end to this end of the site so

really needed to have a retaining wall but we try to soften that the designers try to soften that with kind of a tiered landscaping with the wall and then faux stone built into the wall so it has a nice welcoming look and then again trying to integrate it the best we can with the transportation hub and then a lot of landscaping along this frontage and then the fence which is required as part of the playground licensing doing some fun artwork on there so it has a nice look from the Layton Hall frontage. This just shows we're having ongoing coordination with Rinker Design and our civil and Dave staff and our project team just to make sure we understand the sequence sequencing of the project how the

utility relocations will happen between the two projects and what the traffic impacts are and that we've really thought through all the elements so we have a well coordinated effort. We're making sure we connect the bicycle trail that's along here that comes in and ties into the track here. And I believe that was all. And then where are the responsibilities for the different party? This orange line you can see along here is basically the limits of for the Blenheim Boulevard project and then we're taking care of anything behind behind that project but as you can imagine the construction is going to have to be well coordinated. Going inside the building this is the two levels of underground parking. You see the ramp that comes down the garage entrance.

There's two loading spaces here. There'll be an emergency generator located here. transformer for the building here there are three elevators that serve the building you have two located in the middle of the parking garage you have an elevator on this side at this level it's more of a freight elevator and then we have four stairways that serve the building throughout the number of spaces We have on both levels, we have 249 spaces planned for the parking garage and we're doing seven surface spaces outside the on the Joanne Jorgensen side. So 256 spaces in total. And the last thing to note on this or this plan is this is a location of kind of the building utilities where the electric panels are, the fire control room,

the facilities management kind of shops that will be located. Going into the buildings, again, I know you guys have seen this before, but just to highlight a few things. On the ground floor plan, you have a full-size basketball court. You have pull-out bleachers that will seat up to 350 spectators. You have two half-size courts going this way. It will be striped for pickleball and it will have volleyball inserts. So it will be a multi-purpose court. It has storage back here for gym equipment. Then on this side, this space is a city preschool program. Four classrooms with bathrooms for each classroom. Kind of cubbies on this side with a sink for our projects and the sort. Each classroom will have direct

access to this outdoor kind of walkway that'll connect to a playground, exterior playground that's fenced off. Then going up to the second floor on the gym side you'll have an elevated two-lane track, kind of a wide two-lane track so it's going to feel like three lanes. You have spaces in the corner to stretch in etc. It's going to have two locker rooms plus two unisex family changing rooms that will be for the gym. This is the Parks and Rec's administrative area here. They'll have a conference room storage and offices. You have the fitness classroom and then the gym area with aerobic equipment built into that. other thing I want pointed is just kind of access through the building on the first floor you enter the building here you'll come in this is the stairway that

gets you up to the second floor open stairway you walk straight there'll be some art sitting areas social areas here there's an information desk here for the Parks and Rec will man and then on the backside you come in off the Blenheim entrance here. So it kind of has a long spine across the building and then it's got this long hallway going into the gym into the stairway. On the second level, you can come into the building through the Sherwood Center. So you come through here, this corridor will be built. This is the bridge feature that goes across. This is an existing art room which will be shrunk to make room for You do have to navigate a few stairs because the elevations don't exactly match.

But then you come into the second floor, or you can go up an open stairway to the senior center. Or the seniors can also go this way to an elevator to the senior center. And again, then you have the elevator track, the locker rooms, the fitness, the fitness classroom, and the admin area. This is the third level. and the building will look like a two-story but we'll have a three-story but the third story is set back so you won't necessarily see this from the ground but this is a senior center which is very similar to what's at Green Acres now in terms of space yeah the elevators here you come across right into the senior center there's a check-in desk two offices a large gathering area here a

smaller more intimate gathering area here a demonstration a full demonstration kitchen classroom here and then two classrooms associated with a senior center but are also a multi-purpose located here and then the rooftop amenity space and this is a nice feature that I should have pointed out in the elevation but at some landscaping here that kind of softens that edge of the building and also create some stand back from the edge so you're not peering over the edge of the building. The Performing Arts Center and I want to break this into because part of the modifications to the Sherwood Center are what I call base building which happens whether you decide to do the performing arts options or not and then parts of it are the option. So the base building component

modifications we will make to the lobby to improve the entrance and security as you come into the building and then modifying this arts classroom back here to create this corridor and then the bridge that goes across to the new building all of that is part of base building the optional piece is the addition of dressing rooms. It's basically this back part here. Male and female dressing rooms and then a costume shop here and a back corridor for fire egress and then creating a sound and light room control room here. Redoing the room divider that exists now and then throughout the space is taking down the ceiling to improve the lighting for performances and sound. So the installation of these wood, acoustical wood reflectors, and then rails so you can

move performance lights around depending upon where you put the stage. And the thought is the stage could be in multiple locations depending upon how you're doing a setup or how large the event is. And you could move the lights to fit the specific performance. So that's all the optional piece. This looks at financial impact. And this has been, at least the split has stayed consistent throughout. The building is roughly 42% the cities, 58% the counties. So the costs are split up pro rata based on that. The parking costs are broken apart based upon parking utilization because different uses have different parking demands. So we're really trying to do the math to figure out well what's the utilization of the different uses and

how do you equitably share that cost. And then there's the three million dollar additional city commitment that was discussed last time we met with you and that was really looking at the cost between doing an above-ground parking parking was three million dollars and to make the project go forward the city contributed an additional three million dollars to make that happen and to really be careful about as we look at cost the good news is we're under budget the bad news is there's a long way to go before we get to a guaranteed maximum price so we feel good we're under budget the costs have crept up from the concept to now where we are in the design development and that's what i show down here is at the concept phase when we came to you

it was 123 820. at schematic it was 126 873 and at design development we're at 129 million 650. So from concept phase to where we are right now, it's gone up about 4.7%. And as you go through CDs and we build in design contingencies, but you just find more details as you go through the bidding process and people really have to put pencil to paper and commit that I'm going to build it for this, you see costs can creep up. So we kind of have that awareness going forward. We try to build in adequate contingencies. The CMAR we think helps with that. The counties had several projects go through the CMAR, and they said they have seen some price jumps at the final guaranteed maximum price. So I just, full disclosure, we're trying to manage this tight,

but we also want to be aware that prices can change. Oh, thank you, Brooke. The other thing we're working on is part of the county policy is they do value engineering on any project over $10 million. We just went through a value engineering. We're an independent group of evaluators, architects, mechanical engineers, civil engineers come in and they spend a week kind of going through the going through a process of doing value engineering and they've had recommendations that we're now working our way through. We're not putting those on the table yet because we'll really get the details and what the cost savings are going to be in construction documents right now it's in the range of one to two million but again that's very

preliminary so there will be some savings but it doesn't take us all the way back to the concept level and the cmar partner is also looking at value engineering options we're doing some additional geotech studies. We've priced it based on a conservative assumption of the groundwater and some of the geotechnical aspects. We're doing some additional studies so we can tighten those numbers up. And they're only going to, they should only go down because we went in with a conservative assumptions on the geotech. And then to kind of pull that into this matrix, this is the they're paying this is the city side you know our 42 percent and garage share is 51.93 million the additional commitment is a 3 million so you're looking at 54

930 currently and then 4 million at the concept days we're at 4.5 million on the performing arts we're now 4 million that one came down a little bit and And comparing that to budget, these are already adopted. And then you have a fiscal year 26 proposed of $9 million. So the budget has been, from the concept phase, $56 million. But that fiscal year 26 is not adopted yet. That's proposed. We looked at the operating impacts as well. two tables you have Willard Sherwood on top and then you have the performing arts option at the bottom the total building value I just put here because some of these costs are based on percent of building value so the base building fixture is furniture and equipment and and the best way to

describe FF and E is if you turn building upside down and shake it it's all the stuff that falls out so it's tables chairs desks furnishings anything that's not built in that's that's and we've done a detailed cost estimate on that at 1.28 3 million which would be a one-time cost in fiscal year 27 then the app annual operating cost which I show starting in fiscal year 29 but again the building would open at the end of fiscal year 29 so the first year would be a half year cost but I showed these annualized so this is what a full year would cost so the maintenance which using kind of industry standards the maintenance is somewhere between two and four percent I estimated three percent of building value so this is three percent of the fifty four million capital repairs which are you

replacing pumps, replacing roofs, replacing HVAC. Some people create a sinking fund if you were to create that. Others don't, but this is how you annualize that cost. The first five years are washed. That's kind of built into the warranty and the initial maintenance. But starting in fiscal year 34, it's an annualized cost of a little over $800,000. Security, throwing in a custodial is two and a half dollars per square foot utility is about two dollars a square foot you get a total operating cost of a little over 2.7 million again starting in different fiscal years and then the staff cost of 2.1 million and the discussion there was while that cost staffing in the building will be fiscal year 29 you don't staff up right before you open a building

the previous fiscal year to ramp up staff. And then on the performing arts option, it's a similar type of calculation, just going through the total building value, the FF&E, maintenance costs, capital repairs, custodial security. We're not adding anything on this side of the building. And staffing is all included in the number up here. A summary of staff is summarized on this bullet with two full-time staff and 35 to 42 part-time employees. Some benefited, some non-benefit positions. Then parks and rec are developing a cost recovery model that is in process. Again, as Brooke said, what we're looking for tonight is authorization to move forward into construction documents and what to do with the performing arts

option and you're committing basically to go through cds if you say go forward performing arts you still have the option at the completion of cds before going into construction of hey do we move forward performing arts or not and there will be as we move forward the development agreement every time we have a budget or schedule change we update the development agreement so that will come back to the city council after we're in cds there will be stakeholder and community informational meetings that i talked about in the schedule those will be held in october the entitlement application is in process we met with the bar last night as an last no week last week as a informational meeting that positive a lot of good feedback from them with some good suggestions as well

and then again we would be back to City Council in late 2025 for the guaranteed maximum price prior to moving into construction I don't know why that arrow stood on there stayed on there a long time but

Thomas Rossthank you

Catherine Readanything to add mr. Hardin before we ask the dais for their questions no all right so opening it up to questions from the councilmember Bates

Billy Batesthank you is there gonna be a ramp or an elevator on the Sherwood side up to the bridge by any chance?

James PattersonstaffYeah.

Billy BatesSo I'll go back to that.

James PattersonstaffSo as you come through the Sherwood, so if you come in the Senior Center and you want to go to this third floor senior center the way you navigate that as you come here there's stairs here and there's a ramp here and I believe the elevation difference is three to four feet as you come up this ramp and then to go all the way up to the third floor you can navigate this open stairway to get to the third floor or you walk around the corner here to get to this elevator that goes up to the third floor

Billy Batesokay perfect thank you

James Pattersonstaffthe other and the other Texas a senior center the other ways you park in the garage you basically go up this double set of elevators and that has a landing on each floor including the third floor right across from the senior center

Jon Stehle Jrother

Catherine Readquestions Okay, Councilmember Ross.

Thomas RossYes, thank you for that very thorough presentation. It's exciting to see this moving an additional step forward. Obviously, we have to concur with that, but this is such an exciting opportunity for the city, and I think that sets a very high mark for the future in terms of what park and recreation agencies are doing in terms of the connection with wellness and health and all those good sorts of things.

James PattersonstaffYou mentioned

Thomas Rossif this plan is followed, construction would commence probably in 25. You said that I think there was a possibility of it starting at the end of 24, but more likely 25 would be, or 28 would be those years of construction. You mentioned at the end there that it would be under warranty. Could you explain that a little bit about what that means? and obviously I think many of our residents and we are all aware what a warranty is on a product we buy but how would this relate to the construction of that

Summersstaffyeah

James Pattersonstaffand the constructions actually beginning of calendar year 26 okay so it's 26 sorry I had my wrong date just a little bit less than three years for constructions would be opening at the end of calendar year 2008 okay is the current schedule and the warranty basically you have a one-year bumper to bumper full coverage that the general contractor has so any defects any elements you find anything that goes wrong for one year you're covered then you get all of your normal warranties so the HVAC comes with a warranty the roofing material comes with a warranty the gym flooring will come with a warranty everything will have its individual warranties that's built out and the specification package, and they're all different durations.

Sure. A roof might be 25 years. A gym floor might be 15 years. An HVAC unit might be 15 years. But all those come at the end of the job. They're written over to the city and the county.

Thomas RossRight. So, in effect, and I think you touched on this very well, the city's cost of operation and maintenance, well, operation, there's a certain factor regardless, But in terms of maintenance, it would conceivably be less during those years. But what is an option here is to create that kind of a sinking fund. So as you would with a normal home, you're putting money into reserve to pay for HVAC replacement or roofing replacement or the dishwasher going south, all those sorts of things. And that seems to me to be a very good and thoughtful idea to make sure that it's built into this. Warranty

James Pattersonstaffwill cover it won't cover normal maintenance like replacing a belt or correct right

Thomas Rossnow

James Pattersonstaffyeah those kind of things you would be paying for that

Thomas Rossright but if there's an obvious defect or something went wrong before it should have there would be a way of recovering the car or having that replaced the seniors will be very happy I know to hear that this will be similar to the size of the greens at the senior center of Green Acres I have the privilege of serving as the because of my age and seniority I guess because of my serve on that group and they'll be very excited I know to hear that they're gonna have the same space the option for the performance Arts Center that you presented and maybe I missed this in the presentation but are we talking also about space for equipment storage and for all sorts of things that go with I've heard consistently over the years the need for our arts groups and our arts organizations,

our musical groups, to have places where they can store equipment on a regular basis. Is that?

James PattersonstaffAnd I might, Stacy might want to elaborate on this. We're building in storage with more performing arts storage, costume storage, and we're taking the corner that was a closet and making that into sound and light room to control the space. And then otherwise we have the normal closets that have been there so we're not building more storage into the existing Sherwood Center.

Stacy SummerfieldstaffYes, the additional storage in the addition there would be available to store props, costumes, anything during a performance run there. So it would provide additional storage for the performance but

Melissa Shinaberryclerkby voicewe probably,

Stacy Summerfieldstaffjust because storage is at such a premium we would ask that people move some of that out performances and so that it remain open kind of in a cyclical fashion.

Thomas RossThe reason I raise it, I know this has been an issue for some of the groups in the city and I think we've got to be very clear on what our policy is going to be, how that's going to be used and perhaps we need to somehow think beyond if we do go ahead with this where we could be helpful to some of the performing arts groups in that regard. It sounds like the stage in the lighting would be pretty flexible, so it could accommodate different types of performances, which I certainly support and like. And then my final question was on the construction schedule. If we proceed with the $4 million for the Performing Arts Center, and I understand there will be several stages to that that we would begin with the planning.

But is it conceivable schedule-wise that the construction would all go forward at the same time, or would they be staggered? So it could be one contract for the entire enchilada, if you will.

James PattersonstaffYeah, it would be one contract. And when your HVAC people are in there, they're doing all the HVAC. We haven't gotten to all the details of the construction sequencing. I understand. Because it's going to be an occupied renovation as well. So we've got to figure out kind of how to work around an open building. contract and it'll all to go together. Some of them might be sequenced a little bit later than.

Thomas RossSure, sure. But the idea would be it all go forward at once rather than being a piecemeal kind of thing. And I assume that would be a more efficient way of cost-wise and everything else by doing it all at once rather than having separate

James Pattersonstaffkind of contracts. Yeah, obviously you have an option of you could just finish a design and it's independent enough you could just build it sometime in the future. you kind of get the benefit of big contract, a little piece. So it's going to be a lot more efficient, a lot less expensive to do it as one contract versus two separate. That's helpful.

Thomas RossAnd again, I think getting back to one of the key points for the reason this is such a positive opportunity for the city is to do it together with the county. And I assume that relationship has continued to work well in terms of going these steps, doing the planning and all the work that's going on. still in a very good place with the county right now is that correct good I see his head nod so that's I'm assuming that's an affirmative thank you thank you for that that's actually going really well yeah thank you

Catherine Readother questions from the dice councilmember Bates

Billy Batesthank you one more thing I'm very pleased to see the inclusion of solar panels in the project we've seen a lot we've seen some things in the news about school solar projects in the county being stalled due to the new Dominion Energy interconnectivity requirements. Schools of a certain size that had been slated for solar. Is that something that you all have considered for this or is this of a sufficient size that that wouldn't really be a consideration?

James PattersonstaffYeah I think they've run into problems in some of their fire stations because the footprint is so small for a fire station there's a minimum level of 300 I figure what the number is but we're making we've made sure that we're over that level they've had conversations but we haven't nailed down exactly because this would be done as part of the county's power purchase agreement where somebody else comes in and they install the panels and then we pay them basically as part of that PPA agreement but we feel like we're in good stead with the size of the solar arrays we have on the rooftop okay

Billy Batesgreat to hear thank you

Catherine Readother comments or questions councilmember Doyle Feingold

Kate Doyle Feingoldthanks Mary you mentioned the the rooftop space is for city parks and rec to determine how to use can you sort of explain to the community so is the roof totally under city purview and what parts of the building are under city purview just as my initial question

James Pattersonstaffso if you look at the rooftop piece and i'll stacy can talk about the programming this area here with the double doors here and a single door here this is basically for the seniors so this now you might want to use it for something it's basically city use this space here mostly around the seniors but it could be used however you all want to use it this piece here is part of the infant toddler connection space and so some of the counseling they do for new parents and kind of working with parents and their kids they use outdoor space so they wanted to have a space and it's there's actually a divider here with so it'd be screened between the two uses so this is a kind of a more private intimate space for the ITC so this would

be county a space that they would access through the doors here or door here

Stacy Summerfieldstaffokay The spaces that James highlighted are city use space only. So we would have this rooftop space, for example,

Stephanie Kupkastaffthe senior center, the

Stacy Summerfieldstaffdemonstration kitchen, the two classrooms, those would all be under city purview only. I think as, and this is, of course, we're in preliminary conversations. But as we've discussed it so far, we would want to program every inch of the space as much as we can, all of the hours that were open. so we really see the patio being a senior space during the day when the senior center is open using it prior to the senior center opening for like a morning yoga class to do programming in the evening potential rentals a lot of our classes would be in these two classrooms upstairs we utilize the kitchen for classes as well during the summer or tiny chefs classes the senior center would be utilized as the senior center as it is right now during the

hours the senior center operates from 8 a.m. to right now 4 p.m. and then post that time in the evening we would use it for programs different events so it's all multi-use space especially on the first floor those floor four classrooms that you see so we do have the tiny school the city's preschool program but It would also be used for before and after school programs for Daniel's Run. It would be utilized for summer camp in the summer. It would be utilized in the evening for kids' classes and programs like our I-Code classes. So we envision utilizing every inch of the space that we have. So all the spaces that James highlighted, the fitness center, the fitness classroom, track, gym, our classrooms downstairs, those are all under city control.

Okay.

Kate Doyle FeingoldBecause I've heard some concerns from parents, you know, as a mom of kids, getting into county programs is very difficult. You know, you're sitting there clicking when they open and you often don't get a spot. City programs are a little bit better. And so this is city owned or this is county owned property, this building that we are contributing to. And so there are some concerns about what will be city and will it still be sort of the small community you could get your kids into programs or will it become like the county programs where you can't get your kids into programs? So, you know, that's my questioning there and sort of something to keep in mind and think about. my other question is we have the dollar amount and that is helpful but can we

explain for residents what does it mean you know we're talking about a school bond and fixing schools what does it mean in terms of dollars and cents and our tax rate and the timing of this sorry JC you're

JC Martinezstafffine so based on the slight james slide 13. So slide 1513. So we as was noted, we have enough budget to do the construction aspect as it is stands right now. Not 100% for the performing arts, which is an additional $4 million to maintain operations. Once it opens, then it starts creeping up. And that's I think some of the conversations we're wanting to have with council now of potential just for the community center excluding the performing arts we're looking at about two million dollars in operating costs excluding the capital repair sinking fund which isn't going to come due to poly fy 34. in addition to that another two million dollars on an annual basis increasing every year due to merits and inflation for personnel as well so we're looking about four

million additional dollars to basically operate the facility every single year per year. And so for

Kate Doyle Feingoldpeople, what does that mean for them and tax and?

JC MartinezstaffLooking at about a penny per $800,000, you would divide that. So we're looking about four and a half, almost five cents potential of additional revenue that would need to be generated on an annual basis not 100% on the real estate but just collectively an additional $4 million of revenue that would need to be generated to cover that on an annual basis you add in the Performing Arts Center that's an additional $400,000 and another $200,000 of operating on an annual basis from there as well so

Laszlo Palkostaffby voicethat's why we added the last bullet there I think it's gonna be critical if we if we want a to reduce impact on residents coming UP WITH A COST RECOVERY MODEL WHICH IS WHAT SOME OTHER RECREATION CENTERS COMMUNITY CENTERS DO ACROSS THE REGION THAT COULD GENERATE SOME REVENUE USUALLY NOT PROFITABLE YOU'RE NOT IN THIS TO MAKE MONEY IT'S STILL A COMMUNITY SERVICE SO BUT AT LEAST YOU'RE RECOVERING SOME BUT IT'S GOING TO THAT'S A POLICY DECISION ABOUT WHAT THE PROS AND CONS ARE OF JUST DOING SOMETHING LIKE THAT

Kate Doyle FeingoldOKAY THANKS THAT'S ALL I HAVE FOR NOW

Catherine ReadOKAY COUNCIL MEMBER ROSS

Thomas RossYES UM THANK YOU AND THANK YOU important to put it in the context that that cost of operation is not taking into account any cost recovery, fees, charges, other kinds of things. I know from my own experience, the county has a very active number of recreation centers throughout the county. I think the original intent on that was to make them fully operational in terms of cost through fees, charges, lessons, that sort of thing. I don't know that they've made that mark. I think they're far short of that, and the reality is there would have to be some cost to the city in terms of operation. And I would also throw in that not only with some cost recovery of fees and charges for programs, I assume there would be some staff costs that are already being paid for, for example, a senior center, Green Acres.

The other facilities that we're running would be consolidated at this. So I think the $4 million figure, I want to be careful how we use that because I think it's important to recognize. We're not dumping all that on the city at one point in terms of tax costs to the residents. There will be offsetting costs to that. There will be obviously some cost of operation, and I think we've got to enter into that with our eyes wide open on that. But at the same time, I think this is something that we've heard for years city residents want and would be willing to support. Thank you, Mayor.

Catherine ReadCouncilmember Bates.

Billy BatesThank you. A couple things. First off, as I recall, the operating costs here are just for the city's part of the project, and the county is going to be paying for their part of the project. and also the basketball court inside the project. We don't have a basketball court that is available for sort of drop-in use at Green Acres right now, but this would be available for that once this is built. Is that correct?

Stacy SummerfieldstaffYeah, we would program. Open Gym would be a piece of the programming that we would do. so as James mentioned we'd line it for basketball we could play half court or full court we could also do volleyball and pickleball are the three things we've identified at this point to line the floor with

Billy Batesyeah thank you

Catherine Readcouncilmember Greenfield

Jeffrey Greenfieldthank you mayor can we go back to the floor plan I'm curious on the first floor where where the health center is if kids are coming in or or adults with an infectious disease are they parking in the parking garage are they coming through a secure area or they are they going to be walking through facilities that are under our control as well so therefore exposing potential exposure

James Pattersonstaffwe've tried to isolate the health department on the first floor we kept all those uses together and you can't see it great here there's there's an outside drop-off area there's an independent entrance here if they go in through the garage they would be using a common elevator there's seven surface parking spaces out here so if you come into the health department you don't have to come through the main building although there is an entrance here we've created this entrance here and then they're trying to the HVAC design will create some negative air pressure areas so you try to keep the air from the lobbies and where people are coming in and health department separate from the general population so it's not completely not commingled but we've tried

to create some independence and those spaces and the most of the first most of clients that are coming in for services of getting screenings and those kind of things are located on the first floor at the nurses stations so not

Jeffrey Greenfieldas much on this is that going to be by appointment i i do not know can we find out because i think if it's by appointment only then they can really be driving folks to the parking spaces outside the building and only going through that doorway to take them into the health department versus walking all throughout the rest of the building

James Pattersonstaffyeah we'll report back to you

Brooke Hardinstaffand just to share that that's certainly an aspect that the Health Department itself is very sensitive to and have provided that feedback in terms of design that you see so

Jeffrey Greenfieldcertainly high on their list as well and then the city's preschool program that's not Main Street Child Development Center is this something in partnership with city schools or we

Stacy Summerfieldstaffrun a preschool program out of Sherwood which would move into here called the little school so it's not a day-long sort of daycare preschool it's preschool programming so we have a variety of preschool so that would move into here and then Main Street does plan to potentially bid on the the county's childcare space because they are just a leasing from us over at Green Acres

James Pattersonstaffthis is the county's early childhood program is a space in purple here

Jeffrey Greenfieldand then back to the budget I I appreciate what you're saying about you know a fee structure I expect that there will be something here similar to you know some of the other county facilities where you can go and you pay to go in and do different programming but I think we need to be selling to the community what the worst case scenario could be. And with two new people and 35 to 42 new part-time people, am I reading that correctly? That's the $4 million potential for a $4 million impact. And I think we have to be completely transparent about that and not say, well, it's not really going to be that bad because we're going to have some kind of a fee structure. yet we don't know how much revenue will generate from it so I think we've we've

got to go out to the community just like we're doing with a school bond here's the worst case yes there are some options out there that could make a huge difference but that's not what we have right now and the other piece I would say is is FY 26 we still have to allocate another nine million dollars toward this project am I not am I reading that correctly because that's proposed for FY26. So that's another 9 million we have to put in that then brings us to our share of 56 million.

JC MartinezstaffCorrect. And the five-year CIP that was done three or four years ago, we laid out, or the previous CFO laid out, that budget to get us there. As was noted, that amount in FY26 has not been allocated or adopted. It's just in the proposed. It

Thomas Rossis in the approved CIP, is that correct? It

JC Martinezstaffis in the approved CIP, but we approve the CIP on a per annual basis. I understand.

Jeffrey GreenfieldCorrect. So we still, you won't be here, none of us may be here, but for FY26, that $9 million still has to come from an action from the

Thomas Rossbody. But I do think it's

Jeffrey Greenfieldimportant. I'm sorry, I guess I didn't realize that I yielded the floor.

Thomas RossNo, you did not. All right. Council Member Greenfield has a floor.

Catherine Readfloor

Jeffrey Greenfieldthank you and I will thank I'm sure you will so so now let's just one last piece I think it would be helpful to get a again a slide here we're talking about a lot of different projects with a lot of impact to the city some within budget some are over budget this project we've already heard may come in when we go to construction drawings over budget I think it would be good to understand what that overall impact is I think you started working on when we were talking about schools looking at what's what's funded but over budget what's not funded you know but potentially over budget all those different scenarios I think that would be good to be able to have for the community to have again a full understanding of what people are paying

for and how they are going to be paying for it because ultimately it's going to come to the the residents to pay for it thank you mayor

Laszlo Palkostaffby voiceyes can I add a

Jon Stehle Jrpoint Kind of,

Laszlo Palkostaffby voiceat least from my experience, worst case scenario from a cost recovery. This was post-pandemic reopening. People still hesitant to come was about 25% cost recovery of costs. Usually you're averaging around 40%. I think that's closer to the national standard. But it's a policy decision about what you want your rate structures to be, how affordable do you want it, what the competition looks like. But, again, that's from my experience was the worst case around 25% if you want to kind of present a worst case scenario to residents. And, Stacey, I don't know if you've

Summersstaffhad other

Laszlo Palkostaffby voiceexperiences as well.

Stacy SummerfieldstaffYeah, the typical number that you shoot for is 40% cost recovery. So you look at putting in 60%, getting back 40%. And I think we've looked at a lot of local models and a number of other nationwide models, and we'd be looking at a graded model where things that benefit individuals would be the highest cost recovery and things that benefit the community would be the lowest cost recovery. And so we'd be able to kind of look and get an idea of what the overall building would be.

Jeffrey GreenfieldIt's helpful. I just think it's a number that we should share that because, again, I agree. When we went through the downturn in 2008, 2008, there was a lot of things in the city that was just free, and we could no longer have them be free from room rentals to recovery to cleaning the facility after the rental. All of those things we had to take into consideration. got a number it can shift a little bit but i just think being candid about that i think is really important thank you council

Catherine Readmember ross

Thomas Rossyes um thank you i always believe in in candor and i also think it's very important as this pointed out to be realistic about the numbers that we'll be placing on our citizens to pay for but i think it's also important that we understand and help our public understand that the worst case scenario is probably pretty unlikely as it is in our school funding. We're looking at options. We may have additional ways to recover revenue. So I think it's important that we make sure we get the entire story and not just part of the story. That was a point I was going to make. Thank you, Mayor.

Catherine ReadThank you. Council Member Doyle Feingold.

Kate Doyle FeingoldThanks I just have one addition as part of that analysis I know costs right now for city programs the preschool and the classes at Sherwood and things like that are fairly affordable so as part of looking at that if we are looking at increasing those costs if we could just be upfront about that you know in order to get the cost recovery are we going to have to look at changes in what is free or increasing costs and you know provide that information to the public So,

Stacy Summerfieldstaffyes. So as part of the cost recovery program, we wouldn't just roll it out in one day and be like, this is where our pricing has to get to. We see it as a gradual increase for some of the things that we've held artificially low. And also, I think the other feature of this is to, we have a very generous community. So right now we're able to maintain a very robust scholarship fund to be able to offset programming costs if anyone becomes priced out of the model.

Catherine ReadCouncil members daily.

Jon Stehle JrThank you Mayor Reed. So I'm haven't heard anybody on the dais say that to not move forward which I think is an excellent thing. I said so the guy I think you're seeking for today. I want to call attention to a note we got from the chair of the Planning Commission and I really appreciated his weighing in on the consistency with the city's comprehensive plan. I had the privilege of serving on the Green Acres Advisory Board and that entire document, which seems like a very long time ago because it was a very long time ago. But it's good to see that continuing moving forward. I also remember one of my first council meetings sitting in the Sherwood Center talking to people who were there when it was designed saying going out the back is exactly what we designed it for.

And so as this is probably my last time to, as a council member, comment on this project, I just want to say how excited I am to see it move forward to fruition. This has been eight years of me on the dais. I served on the Green Arts Committee when I didn't win the first term, so it's been a decade of my life shepherding this project through. And it is the absolute right project for the city. We'll work the details. They'll continue to refine and come forward. We'll continue to look at cost recovery. We'll continue to look at the programming aspect of it. ball or is it maybe goalball which is a brand new sport for me that I got to watch in the Paralympics I loved it it was an incredibly fascinating sport in that area but what I know is this is the absolute

right spot for this center I know that because of the work we did to get to this point I know that because of the community outreach we did to get to this point I know that because the conversation we're having with FPYC about how excited they are about having a full-size gymnasium under the city of Fairfax Parks and Recreation Advisory Board and advisory councils and under our own department's control. This is the right project for our city and that's what makes me so excited and to see our chair of our planning commission come in and share that information with us and share the alignment and I loved his closing. Your support of this proposal to proceed is justified and necessary and I can't think of a better way to describe where we're at at this particular moment

for the good of our community to continue this project moving forward. It's the right partnership with the county. Look at those numbers, right? We are in the absolute right space to partner with the county to do this. A public-public partnership? Unheard of. It's an amazing relationship that we have in there. Elevators to get to the Sherwood Center for parking for all the events that go on there so you don't have to walk across the street and go across Blenheim Boulevard anymore. We're leveraging all parts of our community right now to make this investment This is an amazing work session to have right here and one I'm incredibly proud of the decade I've gotten to shepherd it through and now I get to pass it off to the next council to continue it to move forward, right?

By the time we get to construction, I'll probably have one in college and one in high school, right? I can't wait to see where that goes. I can't wait to see us move forward and build this. This is the hard work of government that we have to continue to do. It's the joy we get to have in government. It's the joy to work together with lots of different stakeholders to create and seize the day as we move it forward. So I appreciated the conversation tonight. I heard nobody say no, which is awesome to move forward on there. And, Mayor, I can't wait to see this thing get built when I'm not on the dais. Thank you very much.

Catherine ReadThank you, Councilmember Staley. Any other comments or questions? I would just echo what Councilmember Staley said. This is a fantastic partnership with the county. I don't think we could have afforded to create or build this or fund this without a partner. It is the highest best use of this particular piece of property in the city. It's proximity to public transit, to the Sherwood Center, to two elementary schools. It is in the right place. And it may be aspirational and it does have a price tag. And I appreciate saying that we don't have a blank check in this city to just write whatever it costs. But there are different models and I think we can continue to model as we go forward what it might look like.

There might be cost increases. But again, there's factors that we can't know today, but there are models we can put in place to communicate with the public what we think the impact is going to be by the time this opens in 2030. But I do agree, it's a great project. I am behind it and I appreciate you keeping us up to date and we appreciate the fact that you're going to continue to keep us up to date Mr. Harden.

Brooke HardinstaffThank you madam mayor. So we will take that as consensus to move forward to the next phase And as was said, we will be back again on Multiple occasions actually.

Catherine ReadThank you.

Brooke HardinstaffThank you

Catherine ReadNext

Melissa Shinaberryclerkby voiceon the agenda mission Barry, all right our second items of discussion on the Breckenridge agreement to assume responsibility for the maintenance and operation of the city-owned natural gas street lights on the public right-of-way portion of breckenridge lane i'm going to recognize stephanie kupka the environmental sustainability coordinator to provide the staff presentation

Stephanie KupkastaffOh the purpose of this work session is to discuss a letter received from Breckenridge HOA requesting a license agreement a five-year license agreement they want to operate and maintain the gas street lights that are located on Breckenridge Lane shown on the map to the left Breckenridge Lane is just north it goes off of University Drive this is a public street that leads to the Breckenridge HOA which is located just north of Breckenridge Lane here and along the Breckenridge Lane that leads to the HOA there are ten city owned natural gas streetlights as you are most likely aware the city is in the process of replacing natural gas street lights with LED street lights. The HOA is aware of this and they want to keep the gas lights to maintain consistency between

the gas lights leading to their HOA and also they have 53 gas lights that are part of their community which are located in front of houses or in community areas. so to give you some information about our current and future planned street light projects we we began replacing the the aging natural gas street lights in 2023 so the first phase was completed in the Old Town area where we replaced 40 gas street lights with 25 LED street lights so you here when both the gas lights and the new LED streetlights were there together those gas streetlights in the areas for phase one are now removed so you can see the difference between the two fixtures and phase two is currently underway we'll be replacing 60 gas streetlights in Old Town with 40 LED streetlights for

For fiscal years 25 through 28, we plan to replace the remaining 200 gas streetlights with LEDs. So there are many benefits of replacing the gas streetlights with LEDs. First of all, it reduces energy consumption by switching to natural gas to electricity. That also reduces greenhouse gas emissions and air pollution caused by leaking gas, provides our utility costs and maintenance costs because gas streetlights are very expensive to maintain and operate. It also improves illumination and enhances the lighting. The new streetlights are dark sky compliant so it reduces light pollution and it also improves public safety because the illumination is focused in the areas where we need it on the sidewalks and our streets and

improves public safety another benefit to the LED streetlights is there'll be a six pin receptacle and we'll have the ability to integrate smart city technologies in the future because of all the benefits of the LED streetlights staff opposes entering into a license agreement with Breckenridge HOA some of the other issues that we we're considering is the gas lights the existing gas lights the conditions are really deteriorating so in the near future these gas lights will either have to be painted replaced the the lamps to be replaced so there there's a significant investment that would be needed to maintain the gas lamps the other there's also operating and maintenance risks. There's a liability for maintenance and safety. We've had

experiences with gas leaks and there could be malfunctions. The HOA also may lack expertise to manage the gas lamps infrastructure effectively. And also if we were to enter into a five-year agreement, by the time that time is over and if they decided not to go into a new agreement then the LED streetlight conversion funds will have been expended by then because we're expected to be done with that by fiscal year 28 so then we wouldn't have the funds to then replace them later and I have an image on the left this shows actually is that one of the street streetlights on Breckowitz Lane that was showing a malfunctioning gas lamp to show the issues that we're having with us so we that to our our streets division and they're taking care of it so at this

point we would like your guidance on whether or not staff should move forward with considering of an ordinance that would authorize entering into a license agreement to allow Breckenridge HOA to be maintain and operate the city-owned gas street lengths along Breckenridge Lane I'll now open it up to questions and feedback

Catherine Readquestions feedback from the dais councilmember Doyle Feigold

Kate Doyle Feingoldthanks mayor so in if there is a license agreement would the HOA be responsible for example you know you showed the light that's malfunctioning would they then be responsible for fixing something like that under correct okay so

Stephanie Kupkastaffthey would take on all costs for operating and attaining it

Kate Doyle Feingoldokay could we make it part of the license agreement if they decide not to renew there's some sort of conversion funds to led yeah

Stephanie Kupkastaffso we could make that part of the agreement

Kate Doyle Feingoldand then in terms of the environmental issues that you mentioned i know there's been a lot of discussion about that and a lot of people have natural gas ovens in their home can you talk to what's the comparison so we have people with is a natural gas street light similar different from comparable to the the risks that are from emissions when you have it in your house do we know can we talk yeah

Stephanie Kupkastaffso it's the same natural gas that's used in your oven as it is in the street light so the same the emissions associated with natural gas is much greater than electricity I don't have the exact numbers I can provide those to you. And then also with having a gas stove, there's also the off-gassing of chemicals that go into your household, which also causes a human health hazard. So those same human health hazards with the off-gassing happen in your streets. So as you've walked downtown, you may have smelled the gas and the off-gassing. So similar kind of risks walking in the street, not as much as your household because of the households contained so there's a you know more of a breeze in the streets so there's less risk there but there's still the the pollution

caused from natural gas and then also the greenhouse gases associated is much greater than electricity so

Summersstaffthis would be the first time since I've been with the city that we would enter in a license agreement for a some kind of infrastructure within the city right-of-way. Most of the license agreements we have are either for landscaping in the right-of-way that an HOA wants to do or signage. So this this would be unique because what we would be doing is having a license agreement for something that was taken out of the public facilities manual. This is no longer in city standards and it's a part of public safety. The reason why these lights are being replaced a big part of it is so there's adequate lighting for pedestrians. I'm a little concerned about setting a precedent and allowing something that doesn't meet safety standards, that

doesn't meet lighting standards, that we have never done before as a license agreement and approving that. So they can still apply to the City Council for a license agreement. The reason why we had this work session is, you know, based on the recommendation by the city attorney is, is that just to let you know that if they do come forward with a license agreement application we recommend denial and we would recommend denial.

Catherine ReadThank you for that. Other questions comments from the dais Councilmember Ross and then Councilmember Greenfield.

Thomas RossYes thank you Mr. Summers you answered the first question I had on in terms of have we done this before and apparently the answer is no and a good justification as to why not. If this was implemented, would there be a cost of administration to the city and some responsibility that the city would be required to carry on?

SummersstaffThe only cost would be is for the Public Works Department to occasionally check to make sure that they're doing the proper maintenance of these lights just like we do with other license agreements. The license agreement allows us to cancel it maintained, whether it's landscaping or some kind of signage. If it's not maintained by typically the HOA, we can rescind the license agreement. And that would be the same case with this. And the lights do require a lot of maintenance and they require painting, mantles being relit. Sometimes they get hit by vehicles, they're rather flimsy. Right, right. So-

Thomas RossBut what I'm hearing is there would still be a city responsibility with that, whether it was licensed to somebody or not.

SummersstaffRight. My inspectors would have it on their list.

Thomas RossRight.

SummersstaffSomething to check occasionally.

Thomas RossRight. Right. Thank you.

SummersstaffAlso

Laszlo Palkostaffby voiceto add the cost of enforcing it. Now you're entering into agreement with someone, so there's going to have to be some, if they're not complying, some staff time and potentially legal costs to enforcing this legal agreement now.

Catherine ReadCouncil Member Greenfield.

Jeffrey GreenfieldThank you, Mayor. The lights out in front of Farcroft along Main Street and Blenheim Boulevard. are those the cities or those Farcrofts

Summersstaffthe ones in the right of way are the cities along Blenheim Boulevard okay yes thank you one other thing is we did discuss miss Feingold what you said and and we would if this license agreement was somehow approved by the council we would have in there that if they decided not to maintain them anymore that they'd be responsible for the design and of the LED streetlights within the right-of-way just as we were going to do as part of our project

Catherine Readwhat would be the mechanism for enforcing that I'm just and oh well our city attorney appears as if by magic

Brian Lubkemanstaffby voiceand

Jeffrey Greenfieldultimately we would have provisions in the license agreement for enforcement but

Brian Lubkemanstaffby voiceit could involve taking one of our HOA's to court

Catherine Readright because they're basically you know entering into an agreement where future homeowners of Breckenridge will be responsible right so if it's some future point there's a different HOA board or a different HOA president and they're like oh we don't want to keep maintaining these and the HOA is like yes well we don't want to pay for them then yeah that that whole is on the hook in the future for replacing them at the cost of the HOA

Brian Lubkemanstaffby voicethat's correct and and you know just full disclosure is as many or most of you know obviously the neighborhood on the private portions of Breckenridge Lane have gas lights in front of all of the residences so they do have experience maintaining although those are different lights different size different different volume

Summersstaffand a different cost even though this would we wouldn't need 10 because they have 10 gas lights maybe we would need 5 the cost of the LED lights are almost $15,000 each

Brian Lubkemanstaffby voicecorrect and then the city is relying on a private entity at that point on the public portion of Breckenridge Lane to maintain an object in our right of way and if they do not that does impose a liability on you know and it's been mentioned I think already that the cost of then converting to LED this would be outside of the program the city's already undertaking so that's a question of budget and funds but yeah I mean there's a number of issues and there's a reason why this is a negative staff recommendation it's not because anybody has anything against gas lights at Breckenridge it's just a it is a little bit of a precedent I would argue it doesn't bind the city to doing anything in the future with any other neighborhood but it is different than

what we would normally do and this street is also complicated because again street years ago it was dedicated to public use so now it's a public street so a number of issues

Catherine Readokay any other comments questions council member doyle feingold

Kate Doyle Feingoldum just one we don't have a formal request from them though we're just talking about this no

Brian Lubkemanstaffby voicewe we do have a formal request we we just thought it was best rather than just have it simply appear on an agenda with a negative staff recommendation uh to at least have a brief discussion if there's no consensus or any direction this evening we'll decide what we need to do I mean ordinarily we would just bring these forward but as mr. Summers miss Kupka have noted that it will be with a negative staff recommendation okay

Kate Doyle Feingoldso is there a public hearing for this

Brian Lubkemanstaffby voiceyes it would be by ordinance so two meetings introduction and public hearing in the HOA obviously the certainly the HOA president would show up to speak I would imagine

Kate Doyle Feingoldokay well thanks for the heads up

Summersstaffand

Catherine ReadI do think it it is a more robust conversation about consistency in the We hear a lot about the environment and the environmental impacts of choices like light polluting light fixtures. And we have moved to consistently replace them in the city in response to our residents who care deeply about the bats and the birds and the bees. And so I think it is not setting a very good precedent to allow HOAs to take over gas lights which pollute in the city's right of way. when we as a community have committed ourselves to the best environmental practices possible. So I think this is a larger discussion beyond this one licensing agreement because it sets a precedent, and I don't think it's a good, I'm speaking only on behalf of myself, I think it's a good precedent.

Any other comments? Council Member Bates.

Billy BatesThank you. I certainly share the mayor's concerns as well as staff's concerns, and you know I certainly my biggest my biggest concern is the environmental impact however on the other hand if this were still a private street I'm sure that those would still be owned by the HOA at that point along with the other gas lamps is that probably accurate yeah

Summersstaffif it was a private street we wouldn't be here it'd be their street yeah their lights

Billy Batesyeah and uh you know additionally i think that it's also important to keep in mind that anywhere that you're going pretty much on this street you know correct me if i'm wrong but the uh the trail is of course not lighted and uh within breckenridge they just have the gas lamps yeah um so we we may have greater but then it just kind of ends, and wherever you're going from there doesn't have that. And additionally, I certainly do believe that the benefits are definitely worth it throughout the rest of Old Town, especially in areas of Old Town that are frequented by pedestrians and where there are a lot of businesses. however this little stretch of Breckenridge Lane here is a very pleasant kind of has a very pleasant

ambience to it you know as you're walking along at night or you know near the end of the day with those gas lamps that it would be a shame to lose and additionally that's also sort of a part of our city's history that we'd have an opportunity to in a way preserve we may replace the lights throughout the rest of old town but we'd still have this little stretch of public right-of-way here to kind of show where we came from and you know those have been there as long as I can remember but again I do still share the concerns have been mentioned so I think it's worth further discussion at any rate

Catherine Readany other

Stacy Summerfieldstaffcomments

Catherine Reador questions Paris went LED I think probably ten years ago and the City of lights is still quite beautiful with LED I just put that out for everyone's consideration thank you for the heads up on this we will expect to see it on an upcoming agenda thank you yes

Brian Lubkemanstaffby voiceyes as a reminder these license agreements just like with any sailor five votes to approve so thank

Catherine Readyou

Brian Lubkemanstaffby voicefor

Catherine Readthat heads up

Brian Lubkemanstaffby voicewe'll have it on an agenda we

Catherine Readdo appreciate that okay thank you mr. Lubkerman

Melissa Shinaberryclerkby voicenext on the agenda all right it's our last item and discussion on a resolution to reappropriate the general forward slash operating capital and enterprise funds that were appropriate in FY 2024 and have not yet been spent or committed as of June 30th 2024 i'll recognize jc martinez chief financial officer to provide the staff report

JC Martinezstaffthank you mayor council each year the finance team presents to the city council a list of general operating capital and enterprise funds and a recommendation as to whether or not those funds should be reappropriated the situation occurs when the funds are either one appropriated but as the end of the fiscal year have not been spent or obligated or two a purchase order was not fully expended and the remaining encumbrance balance should be carried over to the new fiscal year f y 2025 the reappropriation of the general operating capital enterprise funds is presented to council at this time of the year in order to take into consideration any year-end adjustments and the final audit work just a quick verbal report out if we go to the i think the third

page on the staff report that shows the breakdown by fund just really quickly on the general fund WE'RE REQUESTING 117 PURCHASE ORDERS TO BE CARRIED OVER, EQUALING A LITTLE OVER $3 MILLION IN ENCUMBRANCES. THE MAJORITY OF THOSE, ABOUT ALMOST A MILLION DOLLARS OR 40 PURCHASE ORDERS, IS FOR PUBLIC WORKS, SO FACILITY, MAINTENANCE, CONSTRUCTION, THINGS OF THAT NATURE FROM THE GENERAL FUND REQUESTING TO BE CARRIED OVER THAT WEREN'T COMPLETED. IN THE CAPITAL FUND, THAT'S WHERE THE BULK OF THE CARRY OVER IS, about 149 purchase orders the majority that's still being in old town hall thias park public safety vehicles that were ordered but haven't been received and then you have the other enterprise funds the wastewater fund the transit fund and the storm water fund minimal amounts minimal number of

purchase orders in totality we're looking at about a little over 21 million dollars or 341 purchase orders from FY24 requesting to be carried over as an encumbrance to FY25. Of note, as part of the year-end closing process, we did review and evaluate all open purchase orders for all funds, and collectively, the departments identified 312 purchase orders equaling $1.7 million that should and were closed, and the encumbrance released and put back into fund balance for fy 2024 so we have done our due diligence we're only requesting what we need in order to maintain operations to be carried over happy to answer any questions

Catherine Readdo we have questions from the dais for mr martinez questions seems very straightforward i think we all commend you for your excellent budgeting abilities thank you for letting us know any closing comments from our city manager

Laszlo Palkostaffby voicenone tonight thank you

Stacy Summerfieldstaffall right

Catherine Readwith that I will adjourn the meeting at 8 32 p.m.

Stacy Summerfieldstaffastonishing